Obesity rate by country vs time

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mbasic
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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#41

Post by mbasic » Wed Jan 15, 2025 3:59 am

asdf wrote: Sun Dec 15, 2024 4:56 pm This is interesting.

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"Since 1980, obesity prevalence among US adults has soared from 14% to 42%. The commonly accepted explanation is pervasive overeating: ever-increasing energy intake as the population gains weight, year after year. However, evidence does not support this hypothesis. National data on energy intake and energy availability show increases between 1961 and 2000, during modern industrialization of food; but a plateau or declines thereafter—even as obesity continued rising—and while physical activity modestly increased. Thus, Americans appear to be eating relatively less since 2000, for ever-increasing body sizes, as time has progressed. Although both energy intake and energy availability are measured with error, such errors would have to be new since 2000 and systematically increasing over time for these 2 separate, independent measures."

"Growing evidence suggests complex, interrelated biological interactions between food processing (including acellular nutrients, depleted prebiotics, additives), gut microbial composition and function, host metabolic expenditure, and intergenerational transmission of risk (including epigenetics, noncoding RNAs, microbial species). In this paradigm, whereas increasing energy intake may have contributed to rising obesity in earlier years, today pervasive adiposity and its physiologic adaptations have created a biological milieu which interacts with industrialized foods to promote escalating obesity, even with stable energy intake—a self-sustaining, difficult-to-reverse cycle."

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9170462/
I think if you look into this, the calorie intake side of "it" is all derived from self-reported data from citizens. IIRC, it was phone call interviews after the fact (after a day of eating). NHANES? or something.

People don't know what they are eating/ate, forget, don't have a sense of portion sizes, weights, fluid volumes, etc. etc. etc.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#42

Post by mbasic » Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:26 am

Off topic here, as this does not relate to the typical obese american....
But in my opinion....as far as the typical forum member and obesity .....

.... I think we, as a group of "lifters", normally middle aged, normally past novice phase, are all eating way too much protein.
You ain't really adding any muscle mass over the course of a year.
A lot of amino acids, protein, N, from muscle breakdown, etc are all recycled quite a bit in the body.
No one here is gaining 10 pounds of raw pure muscle over the course of 1 year.

So in the end, all those excess protein calories, are somehow or another used (or not used)as energy.
And therefore, by and large, we are all over eating by quite a bit....just in general, over eating.

(if you are on TRT+, TRT++, Sports-TRT, or blasting, this doesn't apply to you)
(go ahead: train hard, and eat a lot of clean protein)

---------------------------

My own n=1 ? ...and how I came to my hypothesis?

Funny, I have come to terms that I really can't add any more muscle what I do in the gym, diet-wise, programming wise, etc.
I maybe able to get a tad bit stronger, but impossible to add any significant muscle. Even getting stronger is an issue.

So I don't really care about the gym/or barbell lifts anymore. That, and just too busy with work and coaching.
I do a tiny amount of "cardio", but nothing like previous efforts/eras in my "lifting career" ...previous attempts to lose weight, get healthier, and whatnot.

So therefore, I do not consume near the amount of protein anymore. There is no point.
I have lost a teeny amount of weight; and have no doubt lost some muscle mass; and have no doubt got a tad more BF%.

But funny enough, I had to get some pretty extensive blood work for a couple life insurance policies.
My A1c and all my lipids, BP, HR, etc have never been better.
A1c thing was particularly funny ....because that has always been a little high (but not D2 level or anything), and I did low carb, quasi-keto, periods of regular cardio, dieting, etc.

Long story short: no lifting, barely doing cardio, not really eating less calories (I am not loosing THAT much weight), BUT I am eating a lot less protein. I am definitely be eating more chocolate (85%-90% cacao). A1c has never been lower. A1c 'reaches back' 60-90 days or whatever....

About the only other variable here .... is since its cooled off (Oct.) I have been doing sauna 3x / week. Which I know most people here are going to say the recent sauna-craze/fad is pseudo science. So its definitely not the sauna. Because thats all bullshit, right?

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#43

Post by KyleSchuant » Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:39 am

The Stronger by Science guys mentioned some study of the amount of protein top athletes were having in the Netherlands or some commie EU country like that. And basically it was 1.4-1.8g/kg of bodyweight. They still recommend having lots more, of course, blah blah optimal. But I figure if a national ranked athlete has 1.6g/kg then it should be plenty for me.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#44

Post by asdf » Wed Jan 15, 2025 8:48 am

Philbert wrote: Mon Jan 13, 2025 8:28 pm Another factor in rising obesity at constant available calories is the increase in percentage of calories from highly processed foods.
Another good point.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#45

Post by platypus » Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:25 pm

@mbasic how low has your protein intake dropped?

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#46

Post by Philbert » Wed Jan 15, 2025 10:44 pm

KyleSchuant wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:39 am The Stronger by Science guys mentioned some study of the amount of protein top athletes were having in the Netherlands or some commie EU country like that. And basically it was 1.4-1.8g/kg of bodyweight. They still recommend having lots more, of course, blah blah optimal. But I figure if a national ranked athlete has 1.6g/kg then it should be plenty for me.
There are good studies supporting intake in that range, as opposed to the USRDA of 65g per day. There are fewer studies on the 1g/lb range, but what there is seemed to align with your observation of top athletes. Most Americans get enough protein, it is just really poorly dosed:
Breakfast: Bagel with cream cheese and orange juice and a cookie
Lunch: Salad with shredded parmesan, 1 oz of baked chicken, and half a boiled egg, and all the dressing
then at dinner 80 grams of protein in one sitting.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#47

Post by mbasic » Thu Jan 16, 2025 9:07 am

KyleSchuant wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:39 am The Stronger by Science guys mentioned some study of the amount of protein top athletes were having in the Netherlands or some commie EU country like that. And basically it was 1.4-1.8g/kg of bodyweight. They still recommend having lots more, of course, blah blah optimal. But I figure if a national ranked athlete has 1.6g/kg then it should be plenty for me.
Also .... you get a certain amount of amino acids from all foods, even what is considered non-high-protein sources. Which in turn, the amalgamation of everything you eat, certainly will yield to a high level of protein than counting what they put on the food labels.

So if a 200 pound dude is eating 200 grams of proteins (the was popular: 2g/1 lb. of BW) ...you are probably getting something like 210-250g depending what you eat and when.

In your EU-athlete example 90 kg athlete would be getting 144 g off the food labels ....then a small amount on top of that

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#48

Post by mbasic » Thu Jan 16, 2025 9:09 am

platypus wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:25 pm @mbasic how low has your protein intake dropped?
Maybe 120g per day currently ....about 40 g per meal x 3 meals.

I am 5'10" / 218 lbs.

I would shoot for 180-200g before when I was training hard

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#49

Post by KyleSchuant » Thu Jan 16, 2025 5:57 pm

The Dutch athlete protein consumption study is behind a paywall, but the SbS guys discuss it here.

https://www.strongerbyscience.com/athle ... in-intake/

Interestingly, they match @Philbert's description of the typical diet, with (relatively) low, medium and high protein meals as the day goes on.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#50

Post by Bliss » Fri Jan 17, 2025 1:41 am

mbasic wrote: Thu Jan 16, 2025 9:09 am
platypus wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:25 pm @mbasic how low has your protein intake dropped?
Maybe 120g per day currently ....about 40 g per meal x 3 meals.

I am 5'10" / 218 lbs.

I would shoot for 180-200g before when I was training hard
Is it only me, but doesn't this just mean you went down from very high to "normal" levels even for a training population?

At ~100 kg, you are doing 1.2 g/kg, as opposed to 2 g/kg.

From the previous post it made it seem like you went down into actual low protein... :?:

I'm thinking of people whose protein intake is literally that's tagged along in chocolate bars and desserts, with the closest to meat being fast food nuggets and burgers.

Their consumption is probably in the 0.5 g/kg range as a wild guess?

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#51

Post by mbasic » Fri Jan 17, 2025 1:31 pm

Bliss wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2025 1:41 am
mbasic wrote: Thu Jan 16, 2025 9:09 am
platypus wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:25 pm @mbasic how low has your protein intake dropped?
Maybe 120g per day currently ....about 40 g per meal x 3 meals.

I am 5'10" / 218 lbs.

I would shoot for 180-200g before when I was training hard
Is it only me, but doesn't this just mean you went down from very high to "normal" levels even for a training population?

At ~100 kg, you are doing 1.2 g/kg, as opposed to 2 g/kg.

From the previous post it made it seem like you went down into actual low protein... :?:
The framing here was "people like the people on this board". People who lift, strength sports, physique-lifting, into "sport performance". .... who are probably eating way too much proteins. I disclosed that when I made the post.
Even if you are counting P grams on labels and coming up with 1.2 g/kg .... you are probably in reality getting more than that.
I myself am probably eating too much protein right now.

Not talking about (gen pop)....
I'm thinking of people whose protein intake is literally that's tagged along in chocolate bars and desserts, with the closest to meat being fast food nuggets and burgers. Their consumption is probably in the 0.5 g/kg range as a wild guess?

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#52

Post by Philbert » Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:00 pm

mbasic wrote: Thu Jan 16, 2025 9:07 am
KyleSchuant wrote: Wed Jan 15, 2025 4:39 am The Stronger by Science guys mentioned some study of the amount of protein top athletes were having in the Netherlands or some commie EU country like that. And basically it was 1.4-1.8g/kg of bodyweight. They still recommend having lots more, of course, blah blah optimal. But I figure if a national ranked athlete has 1.6g/kg then it should be plenty for me.
Also .... you get a certain amount of amino acids from all foods, even what is considered non-high-protein sources. Which in turn, the amalgamation of everything you eat, certainly will yield to a high level of protein than counting what they put on the food labels.

So if a 200 pound dude is eating 200 grams of proteins (the was popular: 2g/1 lb. of BW) ...you are probably getting something like 210-250g depending what you eat and when.

In your EU-athlete example 90 kg athlete would be getting 144 g off the food labels ....then a small amount on top of that
For manufactured foods, all the amino acids in the food are included in the labelled protein content, except that the final number is rounded to the nearest gram. Per FDA standards, the protein content only has to be 80% of the labeled amount, so there is no need to understate as a safety margin. If the individual tracking protein intake is only tracking high protein sources, then yes they are getting a bit more from low protein sources as well. Otherwise they are eating the amount they are tracking, or up to 20% less.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#53

Post by mbasic » Tue Jan 21, 2025 3:59 am

Philbert wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:00 pm
For manufactured foods, all the amino acids in the food are included in the labelled protein content, except that the final number is rounded to the nearest gram. Per FDA standards, the protein content only has to be 80% of the labeled amount, so there is no need to understate as a safety margin. If the individual tracking protein intake is only tracking high protein sources, then yes they are getting a bit more from low protein sources as well. Otherwise they are eating the amount they are tracking, or up to 20% less.
[/quote]

ok ... I see the 'manufactured foods' qualifier .... (that is sad term BTW)

....but like beans and rice as a common example. Beans are so-so proteins-wise on their own; rice is almost nothing. Together I think there are something on the order of 20g per serving. IF you are eating a varied well balance diet, I don't think anyone can do the math on all the different combos of amino acids coming together from all the different foods per meal.

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Re: Obesity rate by country vs time

#54

Post by Philbert » Wed Jan 22, 2025 6:22 am

mbasic wrote: Tue Jan 21, 2025 3:59 am
Philbert wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2025 5:00 pm
For manufactured foods, all the amino acids in the food are included in the labelled protein content, except that the final number is rounded to the nearest gram. Per FDA standards, the protein content only has to be 80% of the labeled amount, so there is no need to understate as a safety margin. If the individual tracking protein intake is only tracking high protein sources, then yes they are getting a bit more from low protein sources as well. Otherwise they are eating the amount they are tracking, or up to 20% less.
ok ... I see the 'manufactured foods' qualifier .... (that is sad term BTW)

....but like beans and rice as a common example. Beans are so-so proteins-wise on their own; rice is almost nothing. Together I think there are something on the order of 20g per serving. IF you are eating a varied well balance diet, I don't think anyone can do the math on all the different combos of amino acids coming together from all the different foods per meal.
[/quote]It's not that difficult. 1 cup cooked brown rice, 5 g
1 cup cooked black beans, 15 g
142 gr steamed broccoli, 4.2 g
1/2 cup diced tomatoes, 1 g
1 apple, 0.5 g
Meal: 26.7 g
There are also sites where you can look up the bcaa content of all of that, and you can also find the AA breakdown of each food to see if you are getting your eaas. It is not significantly harder than tracking calories, which plenty of people do.

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