Exodus Strength

mouse wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:02 pm

Brackish wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 7:16 am How are you going to objectively measure their impact on training? Genuinely curious.

I don't have a very scientific method or anything... basically just start using them and see if 'weak' spots I'm looking to fix change. Can I cut down on rest times? Do I have the same burn out I get sometimes with high(er) rep stuff? Do I generally feel better post-training than normal? Supposedly there is benefit to being able to sneak out a few extra reps over time and I'll have a deadlift for reps coming up, so if it improves cool...

Fair enough. I was asking because I could never figure out if creatine did anything for me other than make me thirsty as shit. Finally just quit taking it because I couldn't stand drinking 100+ ounces of water every day and still feeling like I was trudging through Death Valley.

Brackish wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:27 am Fair enough. I was asking because I could never figure out if creatine did anything for me other than make me thirsty as shit. Finally just quit taking it because I couldn't stand drinking 100+ ounces of water every day and still feeling like I was trudging through Death Valley.

Well I've been on creatine for like 3 years now... I honestly don't remember if life was any different without it lol.

I drink a shit ton of water through the day but it's mostly to combat the (probably sky high) levels of sodium in my diet that I refuse to change...

I do start to notice super early if I'm starting to get dehydrated though...

I just switched from coffee to pre-workout, for ease of caff administration/measuring/not having to make coffee + drink betaine/citruline malate pre-workout. Bought "Blue Razz" Gamersupps.GG and got a sample pack. Flavor good, caff effect comes on quick. 100mg caff per scoop (sample packs 2 scoops). Dissolves well and has a host of other probably useless or insufficiently dosed other ingredients. Selected it because I wanted to support a youtuber I like that had a deal with them, the scoop size is very small (1.6g, making it easier to mix with creatine/betaine/citruline and not have too much powder), no sugar and 100mg per scoop is more reasonable than 150/175/200.

mouse wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:37 am

Brackish wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:27 am Fair enough. I was asking because I could never figure out if creatine did anything for me other than make me thirsty as shit. Finally just quit taking it because I couldn't stand drinking 100+ ounces of water every day and still feeling like I was trudging through Death Valley.

Well I've been on creatine for like 3 years now... I honestly don't remember if life was any different without it lol.

I drink a shit ton of water through the day but it's mostly to combat the (probably sky high) levels of sodium in my diet that I refuse to change...

I do start to notice super early if I'm starting to get dehydrated though...

I feel like I drink about 10x the water of your average human being on top of other hydrating beverages (e.g. coffee in the morning, tea in the afternoon, protein shakes, etc.) throughout the day, and I still felt like I was drying out when I was on creatine. Maybe I'll give it a shot again sometime. Still have the bag sitting in my pantry.

Interesting how people have different "feels" with Creatine. I don't get at all thirsty or have digestive issues with it. A few months ago I took an 8 week break from Creatine to see if I was a responder or not and to "clear out my system".
I felt that I was and it had beyond placebo effects on me but when I went back on, I could definitely feel a strength increase after loading plus a few more days and it felt very obvious to me-so...I guess I am.
I'm buying German Creatine to avoid the Chinese, less pure versions.

I'm on Glucosamine, D2, and CoQ10 atm, along with a fish oil cap for fat to help them absorb. I was able to drop Calcium at the end of December after 3 years - which is way more exciting than it sounds.

So far I've been a fan of the Redcon stuff, 350mg of caffeine plus the other stuff helps break the slump/fog of a long work day pretty good. Absolutely no annoying tingling and no real crash noticed. Don't think I would keep up the betaine stuff... once or twice I've gotten a pretty intense 'pump' but I don't typically train that way so I don't think it's doing much more than the citrulline is already doing...

Overall I definitely think it's having a positive effect...

Trialing some stuff this week from Animal to see if I can get the same results at a little lower cost since I kinda wanna keep it up... got a mini can of their pre, intra-EAAs (which has more citrulline, etc in it too), some isolate, and their 'pak' which seems like a vitamin you drink? Severely doubt I'll keep that up but sure I'll try it out...

Anybody taking zinc as a supplement?

I don't remember if it came up in conversation before, and a site search only brought up discussions about barbells...

I take magnesium at night, since I was wary of causing digestive issues when I first started with it -- didn't wanna risk having to shit all day at work if it backfired.

Wondering if there's an "optimal" timing for zinc...

Renascent wrote: ↑Tue Jul 06, 2021 6:47 pm Anybody taking zinc as a supplement?

I don't remember if it came up in conversation before, and a site search only brought up discussions about barbells...

I take magnesium at night, since I was wary of causing digestive issues when I first started with it -- didn't wanna risk having to shit all day at work if it backfired.

Wondering if there's an "optimal" timing for zinc...

There is a thing that has been shown in a study to be an easy way to know if you need zinc. You buy a bottle of Aqueous Zinc (I believe it's also called zinc assay), which is a liquid form of zinc. You put a teaspoon in you mouth and hold it there for a minute or so. If it tastes sweet, you are deficient. If you taste nothing you are not. I am not making this up, as ridiculous as it sounds. It is more accurate than most blood work for zinc levels. And you probably don't need it. And don't taket it at the same time as any other mineral. All minerals use the same transport from the gut into your bloodstream and if the bus is full of one you just piss out whatever other mineral is waiting to go. I know, they sell supplements combining the minerals all together. They are a terrible idea engineered to sell you pills not make you healthy.

Hardartery wrote: ↑Tue Jul 06, 2021 8:08 pm

Renascent wrote: ↑Tue Jul 06, 2021 6:47 pm Anybody taking zinc as a supplement?

I don't remember if it came up in conversation before, and a site search only brought up discussions about barbells...

I take magnesium at night, since I was wary of causing digestive issues when I first started with it -- didn't wanna risk having to shit all day at work if it backfired.

Wondering if there's an "optimal" timing for zinc...

There is a thing that has been shown in a study to be an easy way to know if you need zinc. You buy a bottle of Aqueous Zinc (I believe it's also called zinc assay), which is a liquid form of zinc. You put a teaspoon in you mouth and hold it there for a minute or so. If it tastes sweet, you are deficient. If you taste nothing you are not. I am not making this up, as ridiculous as it sounds. It is more accurate than most blood work for zinc levels. And you probably don't need it. And don't taket it at the same time as any other mineral. All minerals use the same transport from the gut into your bloodstream and if the bus is full of one you just piss out whatever other mineral is waiting to go. I know, they sell supplements combining the minerals all together. They are a terrible idea engineered to sell you pills not make you healthy.

I've been reading about it for the last 15 minutes, and pretty much everything you've said is what I've found (even the "taste test"). Recent blood work did not reveal a deficiency, but my workouts tend to run long and I've been sweating like nobody's business in this humidity.

I've noticed I sleep really well whenever I eat canned oysters with lunch. I might have to look into melatonin instead.

I'll probably pass on the zinc gamble.

Thanks!

Ok, so I've started up with creatine again, for no logical reason at all.

slowmotion wrote: ↑Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:57 pm Ok, so I've started up with creatine again, for no logical reason at all.

Sheeple. LOL.

slowmotion wrote: ↑Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:57 pm Ok, so I've started up with creatine again, for no logical reason at all.

I've started up again (just yesterday) after about 2-3 weeks of intermittent-fasting-quasi-keto.

My thinking is:

-#1-
If I lost some muscle water via depleted glycogen stores ... and creatine is supposed to somehow/help augment muscle cell hydration and promote anabolism something-something-something-bleh-blah-yadda. I've already lost about 8 pounds in two weeks, and I'm sure most of that is water. It will be interesting to see what my weight does over the next two weeks as I 'load up' with creatine .... if my weight continues to drop i doubt its the water thing. I'm either losing fat, or, *nervous laugh* ...wasting away muscle.

-#2-
Also, I figure during training the anaerobic energy system is going to suck donkey cock, because ... no carbs.

I could see doing purely lower intensity (aerobic) stuff like inclined walking treadmill,
OR ,
doing short burst on high intensity stuff (mostly all ATP-CP) with longer intraset rests.

I figure topping off creatine stores to maximum would help with the latter.

-#3-
And, as you say, why not?

Inverstone wrote: ↑Fri Mar 12, 2021 12:33 pm Interesting how people have different "feels" with Creatine. I don't get at all thirsty or have digestive issues with it. A few months ago I took an 8 week break from Creatine to see if I was a responder or not and to "clear out my system".
I felt that I was and it had beyond placebo effects on me but when I went back on, I could definitely feel a strength increase after loading plus a few more days and it felt very obvious to me-so...I guess I am.
I'm buying German Creatine to avoid the Chinese, less pure versions.

Can you be a non-strength but yes-weight-gain responder? Whenever I take creatine I start to rapidly gain weight (like at a scary pace) which based off the mirror test is all fat -- which is confirmed by the fact I don't get any stronger.

The only supplements I've found that change anything about my lifting are caffeine, salt, and (strangely) airborne. If I weren't a father of 2 with no time I'd bother to figure out what exactly is in airborne that might be helping my recovery and top level strength, but instead, I just save it for PR attempt days.

Well, I don't really gain weight when I take creatine, but I might, maybe, get slightly stronger. Maybe. On a good day. Maybe.

Although I've read varied "timings" the general consensus seems to be not to take zinc with others vitamins or no sooner than 2- 2/12 hrs. after other vitamins. This is somewhat of a moot point because many multiples or prostate support sumps contain a bit of zinc.

Any weight gain from creatine is water retention. I've never seen anything about it contributing to fat stores. I "seem" to be a responder because I've experimented on/off periods and every time my number of reps or weight went up after a loading/re-loading phase. Not enough that I couldn't probably get there anyway but it seems to be much easier/faster.

Interesting about the zinc taste test....I'll have to try that. I only have capsules but I'll break one open and see what the taste test reveals. Something I haven't seen mentioned here is that it's important to get some copper with zinc in order for it to be optimally effective.

Inverstone wrote: ↑Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:16 pm Although I've read varied "timings" the general consensus seems to be not to take zinc with others vitamins or no sooner than 2- 2/12 hrs. after other vitamins. This is somewhat of a moot point because many multiples or prostate support sumps contain a bit of zinc.

I've been taking a potassium-magnesium supplement off and on for about two years, but kept coming across suggestions to pair it up with calcium and zinc. I already get about three cups of milk per day, so I considered adding zinc into the mix.

But it seems like the possible cons outweigh the pros, in my case; I don't have a documented deficiency, although my sessions usually take about three hours and I sweat like a motherfucker the entire time. Kinda wondered if a lack of zinc might account for less-than-fulfilling sleep.

Too much zinc seems like a scary problem to create by my own hand, and making sure copper levels don't get sacrificed is more homework than I'm willing to do.

Inverstone wrote: ↑Fri Jul 09, 2021 1:16 pm
Any weight gain from creatine is water retention. I've never seen anything about it contributing to fat stores. I "seem" to be a responder because I've experimented on/off periods and every time my number of reps or weight went up after a loading/re-loading phase. Not enough that I couldn't probably get there anyway but it seems to be much easier/faster.

Yeah, my comment was tongue in cheek. I don't think creatine has a direct mechanism to make me fat, but it's never made me stronger. I'd guess the extra water retention makes me hungrier or something. My point was kind of "weight gain means you're a responder" seems like bad advice. At least it was for me.

FredM, yeah agree with you there. Weight gain doesn't make anyone a "responder" in my view. Improvement in performance, endurance, extra rep or two does-leverages...(?)

I seem to be "lucky" in having almost no visible water retention from creatine-get more of that from things like cottage cheese, salt on food, etc. Ah...genetics and their glorious differences from person to person.

I have to keep my salt (from everything) pretty low) or I balloon like crazy.(always have since childhood). I've said before, but I found that when I switched to "German" creatine which is likely much purer than the Chinese stuff it not only seemed to work better for performance but also less bloat in the gut, more in the muscles.