MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#701

Post by mbasic » Sun Nov 05, 2023 9:16 am

11-5-2023

Welp...where do we start? FB season is over, his is complaining about a knee injury, little swollen and stiff ....from tackle or something.

Our (charter) school ord put together a FB combine for all of the entity's schools in the state . It was put on by ASU and EXOS supposedly. And it was trash:

- only 1 attempt on the 40 and the 5-10-5, no warm ups

- the 40 they would not allow a launch out of a 3pt. start stance....they had to be out of a standing WR kung fu stance.

-force plate for SVJ, no one could land on the thing.

- some other retarded stuff.

-all the kids were still beat up/fatigued/injured from FB which the last game was 7 days ago. Kinda shitty that a couple teams were still in the playoffs and played last night (they didn't show I'm sure)

Only thing they did NOT screw up, because you can't really, was standing broad jump. Same thing only one measured attempt?! MJH hit 9'11" which was surprising.
Not a mistake either as they did it right over the yard/hash marks on a artificial turf field....I saw he went quite a bit over 3 yards. He was stuck in the low 8's for quite a while. And he hasn't practiced this at all for 6-7months or more. So I'm sure training it a bit we could get to just over 10' consistently.

10' standing broad is pretty good. Some conversion charts I have for track-sprint athletes a 10' BJ = exactly what his 100m PR is (and his 10m fly).

I'll give the kids 2 weeks off to heal up and then we start sprint training for the winter

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#702

Post by mbasic » Tue Nov 14, 2023 12:05 pm

Still on deload.
He says his knee is still a little gimpy from football.
He still lifts though.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#703

Post by mbasic » Mon Nov 20, 2023 1:48 pm

11-20-2023

The Great Work to begin today....

I, as the sprint coach of our track team, offered a few of the kids on the football team a winter speed training block .... free of charge.
Basically, I looked at all the kids not doing a winter sport, and went after those kids.
("it" won't "work" along side a varsity winter sport schedule obviously)

Was hoping for about 6 kids (keep in mind our school is super small, only 26 kids on varsity FB team).
I 'sold' it to them as it wouldn't be hard, no conditioning, no laps, no build-the-aeobic base, no lactate, nothing 'hard' ..... just short sprints, max V, speed work, short hill sports.

I think I'll have ..... THREE ! kids today .... one of which is my son. Lol this place sucks.

JN: the 10th gr hurdler bailed last minute, he is going to help out the football team.
(what will happen, he'll get into track this next season, be slow again, and get put off and quite .... or not come out anymore)

NP: ic complaining about rando injuries, but did the combine, and played all of the final games at school.
I get the feeling he is using that as a excuse.

IW: his dad sounded like he was on board, but since ghosted me.

AP: same, dad sounded excited, but then mentioned he needed to do a school winter sport to keep motivation to keep his grades up.

Everyone else that is remotely fast or quick not slow is doing soccer or basketball. There is pressure on many of the kids to do a winter sport, and do 3 sports .... something something 'Letters' and this Thing-of-the-Year award for student athletes. I get it, and I'm not going to get in the way of that.

BUUUUTTT .... I actually think/know:

#1- its not healthy. Many of the football kids, who play 80-100 snaps per game, are spent and quasi injured. Its taken my son about for his knee to clear up. The other kids went to soccer or basketball practice the very next Monday after the last FB on Friday. They should all have 2-3 week minimum off.

#2- None of the football kids will NOT get faster, stronger, quicker, by playing a full season of soccer/basketball. Same thing, they will all show up for the 1st day of track practice (or baseball) expecting ..... what? IDK? Then late spring/summer FB starts up ...... and the poor head football coach is dealing with 25 kids who are slow weak and a pile of goo.

This would all be more productive if they only did 2 sports. I was thinking about leveraging the HCFB. He isn't a teacher or tied to the school (or other sports here). He needs to tell the kids to lift in the off-season AND do whatever is necessary to get faster.

Got to go coach....

Here is a funny Track meme....



I told mikey to do this in his next non-important 4x400 meet.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#704

Post by mbasic » Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:07 am

11-20-2023

20m hill sprint (acceleration/starts) x 2r x 6s on 3' start intervals

That's it.

I had 3 kids show up!

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#705

Post by mbasic » Sat Nov 25, 2023 8:44 am

11-22-2023. Wed.

Today the school was out...they start Thanksgiving break a day early .....so we got to use the field.

Only two kids showed up, my son, and one other.

(10) Wicket runs about 40-50m

Brought they juggs machine to screw around between reps. I purposely took a bunch of video and made a post on Instagram so the other kids could see what we're doing. I.e. it's fun and not hard. Sort of a commercial lolz.


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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#706

Post by mbasic » Sat Nov 25, 2023 8:47 am

11-24-2023. Friday

Again, only one kid showed up other than my son
.
Max V flying sprints : 20yd fly x 4 w/ 7' rests

MJHs last one was near PR levels.
Form was excellent today.


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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#707

Post by mbasic » Tue Nov 28, 2023 5:18 am

11-26-2023 Sun 12pm
Did wicket runs at CVHS.
Only (7) at 55m approx.
Spacing was 5'11" to 7'3"
Took some flys within the last 10m of the hurdles. slowish.

Boy does CV's track suck dix. We will not come here again.
Right when I stepped on it, it seemed hard as fuck.
We were JUST at GHS 48 hrs ago and I could tell the difference underfoot with training shoes.
A big crack has developed between lanes 5 & 6 on the back straightaway....that wasn't there last year.
Only plus side maybe they'll resurface it this summer? And next winter it will be nice.



========================

11-27-2023 Mon 4 pm
With the school sprint group.
Hill sprints on the con'c apron.
20m x 2r x 6s on 4' start intervals.
Times were ~0.15 better than last week?! really had my head scratching.
AP ran slow
LA ran very well 0.15 better.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#708

Post by mbasic » Wed Nov 29, 2023 4:22 am

11-28-2023

just some interesting shit that goes along with the "Kids' sports are awful" theme:
Wow, a lot of coaching gossip and drama last two weeks or so....

FOOTBALL:

- The big public HS he was going to transfer to, the head FB coach quit out of nowhere. (GHS)

- Two GH Charter schools, the head coaches quit (one, he used to go to pre-4th grade, his sis went there) (CPA, TrvPA)

- A big time destination FB HS head coach quit. (HHS) This was the guy who took over after the hazing scandal from
about 6 or 7 years ago. Some FB boys basically raped some other FB boys!?!...I believe something about a broom handle being
stuck up another boy's butt-hole.
No lie. News article says source was deposition transcript: news article uses the words "fingers and objects" and "penetration". Anyway, this coach took over for whole staff that was fired from that issue...he quit yesterday.
Funny, the old coach who was in charge at the time of the hazing (got fired) received a 5 or 6 year ban from coaching in our state.
Some in the HS football realm, have suggested that HHS could now/should now re-hire him. lolz

- We've had 12 HSHC openings since the last week of the regular season.

- OH, I don't know if I mentioned this before: But the school who was responsible for letting a player drown in a lake up north .... well, the school district HAD to fire that entire staff: HFBC, the AD, etc. in the pre-season. And the interim HC guy is now being replaced.
Basically a school in the hood/inner-city had their late summer FB camp up north, (almost every big school does this). I guess the team went swimming in a pond late afternoon, early evening, at night or something. A kid disappeared. Big deal in the news. Couldn't find him. Dive/search team had to be dispatched up there from phoenix to dragnet lake. Found body a day or two later. Maybe too cold and had a heart attack? No one knows. Anyway the temp-HC who replaced the fired HC quit. Terrible situation.
I'd hate to make the racist accusation that black people have a hard time swimming, but that could obviously (likely) be a thing with living in the inner city with an impoverished situation. I doubt the kid's parents paid for swim lessons at AquaTots or whatever. If he lived in a shit neighborhood, I doubt his family, or friends, had swimming pools like suburbia. Coaches were retards if they let this happen. I bet the kid was pre-exhausted from all the football training, and the sudden cold-ass water (7000 ft elevation BTW) shocked his heart into stopping....I could see it.
Sadly, my daughter had a close friend (black male) who died the same way at the lake here in the desert. Lake trip with friends, water skiing, cliff jumping, tubing or something.....drowned in the lake (my daughter wasn't there). I think in hindsight, maybe they all came to the realization that he was never formally taught how to swim or something. Fucking sad (and stupid)

TRACK:

- I think that Sprint-guru-Youtuber guy at ArcdHS quit as track head coach, as there is an opening for HC for Boy's track there. That lasted two years. I reached out to this guy several years ago to coach my son. Pay for private lessons. He kind jerked me/us along a bit and then ghosted me. Fuck him. While googling him a found out he was actually sanctioned by USADA for PED use. It was something stupid like SARMS and/or peptides. What an ass.

- I think that one of our old track coaches quit at MsqHS (there is a HC track coach opening, AND a DB/FB coach opening...that him). This was the young kid who told mikey to "push thru" his back injury.

- Came across some info on our old-old track coach, who is still considered "venerable" amongst the staff, and a 'good' track coach. He had coached here for 8-9 years or something and went onto CVHS as the HC for track. I guess the job he "left" before coaching our school, he left on rather
....unsavory?...circumstances. I guess he was fired, after a female student had said some ..... stuff ..... and it was found that the coach and the student had texted a bit. Coach said girl had a crush on him, and when he didn't want to play along, she went ballistic/psycho or something-something. I guess they fired him, but then after the investigation, they found he nothing TEHCINCALLY wrong .... but then, they reeeaaaallly didn't go out of their way to exonerate him and/or rehire him. So they he kinda sued the state, under the guise that the charter-school was an agent of the state .... and he was wronged and smeared or whatever. Case got quashed; but it brought up and laid down some interesting case law with regards to charter schools and their ties to the State gov't. So his case is now kind famous (infamous?) and documented as a case-law example. Another minor detail about his new HS (CVHS) .... the track is shit now. We used it Sunday for those wicket runs. Hard AF, and starting to get big gapping cracks. Feel sorry for those kids who have to run on that shit day in day out.

- Ran into one of my sprinters from last year, BN. He is running for the local community college. Since he graduated, we have been talking about how is training is going at CC. Long story short, they run him into the ground. They treat everyone the same during fall-preseason training. Lots of running and bleachers and stupid shit: short-sprinters, long-sprinters, distance people, jumpers ....all do the same stupid shit. BN came out we we did those 20y flys last Friday.....just hung out, didn't run. He mentioned the two coach's name and it instantly rung a bell: The woman is ANOTHER COACH who ghosted me. She's on coachup.com as a private coach ...initially, she led us along a bit, but then went into ghost mode. Her and (what I assume) is her BF: do private lessons; have a youth track club; coach at a high-school; and NOW i guess they are the sprint coaches at that CC also. Whats really funny, is our school might 'rent' the track at the HS that they coach at to train during this season. Its a huge campus ....they just refurbished everything there: new track, new art/turf FB field ....there's a couple mini-art.turf training fields off to the side. Superduper nice.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#709

Post by mbasic » Fri Dec 01, 2023 3:45 am

11-30-2023 Thurs.

He wanted to do something today, even tho it was off-script.
MesqHS track; 6pm; drizzly out
(3) 20m flys 7'r
Very good times considering where we are at ....pretty much as good as, or better than, where we left off last year.

===========================

In other news, another HSFB kid died.
He was shot in the aftermath of an argument and died later ...
This was about 8 miles from my office.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#710

Post by DCR » Fri Dec 01, 2023 8:09 am

mbasic wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 3:45 amIn other news, another HSFB kid died.
Jesus.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#711

Post by mbasic » Fri Dec 01, 2023 8:50 am

DCR wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 8:09 am
mbasic wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 3:45 amIn other news, another HSFB kid died.
Jesus.
There was kid who drowned at FB camp.
And this kid that got shot.
And I believe one other .... but it escapes me right now

=========================

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#712

Post by mbasic » Fri Dec 01, 2023 9:06 am

Just an interesting training note:

I think I have found a new scheme that has been working on my squats and legs.
Its very simple
Punching it into a e1RM calculator with RPE is funny...

DAY 1
ATG HBBS: 73% x 8 x 1 set; then 60% x10x3
usually nothing else, maybe leg curls

rest a day or two

DAY 2
RDL 290-300x8x3
LEG EXT MACHINE ###x15x4 ...massive burn pump sets.

rest a day or two

DAY 3
BOX SQUAT (a high squat) work up to 1 or 2 sets of 6 heavy

rest two days for sure then repeat.

the weird part is, there is no way I can do this without being sore from Day1 or Day 3.
From Day 1 my quads are really sore.
Day 3...my ass and hamstrings are sore.
Day 2 does nothing really.
There is no way I can can't the frequency up. If I rest only 1 day between workouts, I have a bad day. If I rest two, I almost go 8 or 9 days between Day1's and then terrible DOMS from those higher rep sets. Also weird that 2 sets of 6rep with box squat create notable DOMS also.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#713

Post by mbasic » Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:58 pm

lolz, that last^ post was supposed to go into my own training log, not here.

=======================

Anyways, still training and preparing for track season.

12-11-2023 - sled pulls. x2r x5s @ 25-30 yds (until the acceleration stops)
fairly complete recoveries
he used a 15 kg plate (+33#)
on grass at hlms park in cleats

=========================

12-13-2023 Wed

Wicket runs at the park.
static 6' spacing, about 22-25 hurdles. (35-40 yds)
PVC pipe over head; gun pose; etc
Maybe 12-14 run throughs.

=========================

I have a 3rd (4th?) kid that wants to join:

There is:

- MJH, my boy

- L.A. who quite frankly seems disinterested, has used the word 'chink' refering to asian people (he is somekind of latino-adopted-mixed race)

- A.P. who doesn't seem very fast at all, but is motivated, but is doing another recreational sport on the side 6 days a week ( not a school sport)

- N.P. who seems kinda fast, and is coming off of PT for a reoccurring hamstring injury. He starts with us in a few days.

So this seems kinda fucked to be honest. Was hoping for 7-10 football kids to show interest.

I think I have a pretty good idea what I would like to do after my son graduates high school .... if I am still interested in coaching track. I am kinda sorta staring down quasi-retirement too. Sister wants to get out of our business; I am about done mentally as well.

I briefly thought about coaching track (sprints) up north, at my future quasi-retirement home (that's not built yet, lolz, I do own the land).
But then again .... from what I can gather: It is, possibly, a bunch of white racist mormon kids. I don't know if I could take it.
There is some other logistical problems up there with training in the early spring and winter.

There is a quasi-charter-private-school in the downtown urban area (where I live now) for "disadvantaged kids". But yet, it is some kind of college prep HS at the same time? So I think the parents/family structure and kids might not be all that bad discipline wise or what have you. We play them in football, they perennially suck ass ....BUT DO manage to get a lot of kids out on the team somehow. I think the coaching and general support is trash. The do not do many other sports. No baseball (spring, when track is). I do not see they field a soccer team. The basketball roster and football roster do not overlap much at all (only 3 kids).

I think I want to explore coaching there as a volunteer or something.
Funny, on their own website, I see they do list 'Track' as a sport. But they have not posted any AIA times in the last several years.
The campus does not have a track. There is a local comm college nearby (2 miles), their track program is currently defunct, but they do have a synthetic track there in good shape.

Plan is:
1- talk to AD and the FBHC to see if they want to do this, and see if its feasible.
1a - I would take every available FB kid not in another sport and train him winter thru spring.
1b - we would only field a team of short sprinters (100,200,400), relay teams (4x1, 4x4), maybe long jumpers and hurdlers. 20 kids?

2- talk to the CC, and see if we (these poor disadvantaged kids) can use their track carte blanche free of charge. I COULD do a lot of training at the school. I have my methods and special equipment ;)

3- then see if the kids will do it. Might have to get with the parents.

I'm almost positive it would work. Kids would wind up being wicked fast for football. We would compete is the very smallest Division for track, I'm sure we could (with proper training) make a lot of noise and win some medals. We all ain't supposed to be racist but: they do have a lot of black kids in that area. Also, typical privileged suburban prep school kids (where I'm at now) seem soooo disinterested in even trying to excel at high levels to just "get better" just for the sake of getting better.....whether is for themselves, the team, or the school. My son's current AD and I had a talk about this recently. The word 'apathy' was used.

The problem is at a school with a super small population, like ours currently, you now have so few kids who GAF .... when it comes to football, which is akin to combat, this is a big problem. Same for track.

If I'm going to 'waste my time' coaching kids to scratch an itch, I'd rather do it with a population who might really appreciate what I am doing .... and/or when the reap the benefits of good coaching .... well I think it would be more rewarding to be these 'other kids'. Maybe I'm fooling myself....but I'd rationalize this as some form of "giving back", or "helping" these kids.

I just wanted to type this out, hopefully it comes to fruition.
Last edited by mbasic on Thu Dec 14, 2023 5:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#714

Post by DCR » Tue Dec 12, 2023 7:29 pm

mbasic wrote: Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:58 pmI just wanted to type this out, hopefully it comes to fruition.
Make it so. It’s an awesome idea.

Just curious, is the proposed retirement “north” still in AZ, or really heading north?

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#715

Post by mbasic » Wed Dec 13, 2023 4:11 am

DCR wrote: Tue Dec 12, 2023 7:29 pm
mbasic wrote: Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:58 pmI just wanted to type this out, hopefully it comes to fruition.
Make it so. It’s an awesome idea.

Just curious, is the proposed retirement “north” still in AZ, or really heading north?
northern AZ, which really is a misnomer also.... more north than the Phoenix, but yes still in AZ.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#716

Post by mbasic » Wed Dec 27, 2023 7:14 am

12-26-2023

Still training.

I lifted with him the last couple of days. He really hasn't gotten any stronger. Was down to 152 BW.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#717

Post by mbasic » Mon Jan 08, 2024 9:59 am

I'll do a write up on the combine he attended later; so much fuckery.

Below is for the lady who commented on my son's "bad running form".
(was 1st place at the event)

...he was the only one who hit this position at the finish (~maxV condition).
Most everyone looked like "Soccer athlete" or "16 y.o."

Image


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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#718

Post by mbasic » Tue Jan 09, 2024 6:26 am

1-6-2023 Football Combine.

Long story short: It sucked overall.

The outfit putting it on used to be really good; apparently, they got bought out, or have employed different people to run it....
The would have x-NFL fuy come out. At the previous youth-combines...like 150 kids. Today is about 40 HS and youths.

Warmup was an hour long, kids were probably getting gassed/tired.

Somehow, they deleted MJH's second 40 time, which was really fast (4.55x) .... I think they thought it was timing error with their gear.
OR
the guy running it, he has a side-gig where he trains youth-athletes.
A lot of his kids/clients were there.
I think the guy was irked that MJ outran his alpha kid that he had trained.
This guy also posted some other stuff featuring his own son (another/different kid).

I didn't think anything of it at first, but they did a 315 trad bar deadlift for reps....MJ had 10, but they only posted him for 7 on their social media.
They even posted a IG-story of a montage of the event.....
....they got footage of MJH deadlifting and the assist.coach counting out "7....8....9....10".

Some lady on the field (who seemed like she was an admin or something) commented about MJ's "goofy running form". She said this aloud well within earshot of him. I was like WTF really? (see prev post). He does moves side to side in his first few steps off the line, but otherwise all of his positions are fairly textbook.

The owner (NOT the guy running it, herding the kids around, running the timing, etc ) came up to me after the 40's, and said he recognized me at 'these events'. I said we were only at one of these previously. Asked for my kid's last name. He instantly perked up and said "your kid ran really fast! [something-something] he would be good at track". I replied, "well, he DOES run track". He also recognized my weird last name, and said commented that he had remembered my kid doing well at a previous combine....and humbly said yes, "he won the 40 at the one in '21 at AHS" (which in fact he won like 5 events: 40, pro-shuttle, L-drill, VJ, medball-throw). Point here is, that dude saw/heard the 4.55 40 as well.

They did trap bar DL for max reps, and bench for reps. With no warmups or anything. Shit was crazy, as this thing was mostly a youth/peewee thing: a lot of 8,9,10,11 year old who had never lifted. They had lowered the bar weight for those younger divisions, but still ...not a lot of pretty lifting as you can imagine.

4.55x 40y (they only posted his 1st attempt 4.717)
4.57 5-10-5 shuttle
7.2 (h) L-Drill
32" SVJ (an e-mat)
9.2' broad jump
BP 135# x17
TBDL 315# x10 (high handles)

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#719

Post by mbasic » Mon Jan 15, 2024 2:24 pm

I'll try to keep this log more current now that the track season is getting underway (or closer).

1-7-2023 - REST

1-8 - REST

1-9 - ACCEL. hill sprints in parking strctr. 31m x6 3'r; Then lift legs later

1-10 - REST

1-11 - Short Sprint (60/100) Endurance W.O.
20m flyx3r wrb x2s 8'r
1 x100m fly

1-12- REST

1-13 - ACCEL.
Blocks 30mx2 wbr x 5 5'r;
(reads: 30m from blocks x 2 reps with walk back rest x 5 sets 5 min rests for sets)
Lift Legs DL 315x5; DB lungs 40's x7x3, core, etc

1-14- LIFT UPPER BODY
various stuff

1-15 - LACTATE!
3x flying 150m at front end 400 pace, but failed, he could not run the third rep
16.92
16.80
these were way too fast.
17sec x 3 would be a theoretical 51.0 400m time.
He should not be in that kinda shape right now of course.
Ego got the better of hime.
5.38 around the curve tho ..... that's decent.
Oh yeah, we did the tightest turn in lane 1 here (normally 7 or 8 to keep speeds up)
to get used to the tight indoor track meet we have coming up.

He never has done well with this workout.
Even when we runs all three times in a tight range, his predictor formula
doesn't equal his most recent performance on the track (immed.before or after)
IOW: the formula seems harsh for this workout.

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Re: MJH KID-SPORTS ARE AWFUL LOG

#720

Post by mbasic » Thu Jan 18, 2024 2:17 pm

1-16-2024
Rest, he may have lifted upper body

1-17-2024
Working on the coming indoor meet.
Short 200m track has tight ass turns.
Apparently, the 200 race consists of starting on the straight with about a 40-50m straight run in ....going into the curve full speed ....the TIGHTER short track curve.

The curves of a standard outdoor 400m track are ususally never a problem in this regard, as the outside 200m race you start on the curve, so you sorta just build from a full stop, and the 200m race there is a slight pacing factor to it. Same for the outdoor 400m, you start on the curve, even more submaximal pace, and the 2nd curve you are starting to gas-out..... but with the 200m indoor, you run full blast (nearly) right into the tighter curve.

So today we did....
Lane 1, tightest lane possible
about ~50m straight, drop in start, full accel, into a 20m max V fly on the curve.
x3 reps 7' rests (about 70m in reality)

then same, but took away 10m on the accel, and added 20m to the fly for 40m fly on the curve.
x1 rep 8' rest

then same, but just measured off a 35m fly using the hurdle marks, was "deeper" into the curve
x1 rep

so... 7 x 70-80m hard sprints on the curve?

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If anyone here from az reads this.
In like 6th grade, my son was good friends with one of the kids who are an alleged Gillbirt Goonny.
To fit this in with the Kids Sports are Terrible theme .... kid/suspect was RB2 for a local HS.
We hadn't interacted with him for many years, but hearing the (unique) name in that context was wild.

In other news.... along the same 'Terrible' theme, at least they caught the other guy who shot the other HS RB (and killed him).
...I mentioned this a while back with the GG case. I guess they are not related...not the same gang/group of suspects.

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