Who is on a cut?

[broseph]

Alright, if we’re posting pictures of uncle Iroh, we gotta show Heihachi for fair representation:

[alek]

The flu threw a big wet blanket on my cut; I completely stopped losing weight and gained a bit on my umbilicus. I'm all better now, and I think I'm going to continue cutting into January even though my initial plan was to start maintenance on Jan. 1.

I still want to bulk through November, filling out the 90kg weight class for the meet then. I'm willing to start the bulk a little later if I can shave a few more pounds and a few quarter inches off my umbilicus if I can get the cut back on track quickly.

[FredM]

The flu threw a big wet blanket on my cut; I completely stopped losing weight and gained a bit on my umbilicus. I'm all better now, and I think I'm going to continue cutting into January even though my initial plan was to start maintenance on Jan. 1.

I still want to bulk through November, filling out the 90kg weight class for the meet then. I'm willing to start the bulk a little later if I can shave a few more pounds and a few quarter inches off my umbilicus if I can get the cut back on track quickly.

Same. RSV though. Hysterically worse than COVID was for most of my household and hit me and my 1 year old the hardest. Was basically 1 week into the cut and felt like I needed to eat just to survive. Sickest I've ever been in my life for 10 days and wasn't over it for 3 weeks almost. Then holiday season hit and I'm basically at square one (I'm down 2 lbs probably of just water weight).

So here goes again. Cutting hard starting tomorrow. Gonna be on that sweet New Years resolution of not being fat train.

Realistically I won't be bulking until the summer now.

[alek]

The flu threw a big wet blanket on my cut; I completely stopped losing weight and gained a bit on my umbilicus. I'm all better now, and I think I'm going to continue cutting into January even though my initial plan was to start maintenance on Jan. 1.

I still want to bulk through November, filling out the 90kg weight class for the meet then. I'm willing to start the bulk a little later if I can shave a few more pounds and a few quarter inches off my umbilicus if I can get the cut back on track quickly.

Same. RSV though. Hysterically worse than COVID was for most of my household and hit me and my 1 year old the hardest. Was basically 1 week into the cut and felt like I needed to eat just to survive. Sickest I've ever been in my life for 10 days and wasn't over it for 3 weeks almost. Then holiday season hit and I'm basically at square one (I'm down 2 lbs probably of just water weight).

So here goes again. Cutting hard starting tomorrow. Gonna be on that sweet New Years resolution of not being fat train.

Realistically I won't be bulking until the summer now.

RSV with the little ones is no joke. A cousin had their infant in the ER twice in one year with RSV.

***

I got the cut back on track I think; we'll see if the umbilicus will move in the right direction.

[Brackish]

The flu threw a big wet blanket on my cut; I completely stopped losing weight and gained a bit on my umbilicus. I'm all better now, and I think I'm going to continue cutting into January even though my initial plan was to start maintenance on Jan. 1.

I still want to bulk through November, filling out the 90kg weight class for the meet then. I'm willing to start the bulk a little later if I can shave a few more pounds and a few quarter inches off my umbilicus if I can get the cut back on track quickly.

Same. RSV though. Hysterically worse than COVID was for most of my household and hit me and my 1 year old the hardest. Was basically 1 week into the cut and felt like I needed to eat just to survive. Sickest I've ever been in my life for 10 days and wasn't over it for 3 weeks almost. Then holiday season hit and I'm basically at square one (I'm down 2 lbs probably of just water weight).

So here goes again. Cutting hard starting tomorrow. Gonna be on that sweet New Years resolution of not being fat train.

Realistically I won't be bulking until the summer now.

RSV with the little ones is no joke. A cousin had their infant in the ER twice in one year with RSV.

***

I got the cut back on track I think; we'll see if the umbilicus will move in the right direction.

We had the neighbor's two oldest boys for a few nights right before Christmas because their littlest one (about 2 months old) ended up in the ICU due to RSV. That shit is nasty, for sure.

[Brackish]

Planning to do an extended cut starting February 1st through the end of May. I learned quite a bit the last two times I cut, so I'm hoping I'm a bit more successful this time around. First time - everything weighed/measured, down to the gram. I lost quite a bit of weight, but it was extremely mentally taxing. Results were solid, but I didn't get exactly what I wanted. Second time - I just basically cut processed carbs and most fats (excluding those from my protein sources) out and ate whatever I wanted as long as it was a protein, fruit, or vegetable. Again, the results weren't bad, but they weren't as good as my first attempt.

Current height/weight: 5' 9"/158lbs. w/ an estimated BF of 20%. May be a little higher or a little lower. I don't really know since I'm relying on the Navy Calculator for that.

Target weight: 138lbs. (I think I'm going to have to get this low to actually see my abs...or have them look the way I want them to.)

Plan: Going to have to go with the weighed/measured approach to get what I want, but I'm considering leaving out approximately 100-200 calories a day during the week to give me a little more "wiggle room" on the weekends.

Workouts: I'm planning on transitioning from a blended training approach (low reps/higher weight on main lifts w/ higher reps/lower weights on accessories) to a full on higher reps/lower weights across the board. This may or may not include stopping most of my barbell work entirely (e.g. subbing in hack squats for barbell squats, etc.).

Questions for the hive mind -

1. What do you think of the overall plan? (Do you think my target weight is too low?)
2. Do you have a preferred calculator you use for daily caloric intakes as well as macro breakdowns for stuff like this?
3. Is there a better way to figure out my starting BF% that won't cost me a bunch of money?
4. Is there anything I seem to be missing here?

[Hardartery]

Planning to do an extended cut starting February 1st through the end of May. I learned quite a bit the last two times I cut, so I'm hoping I'm a bit more successful this time around. First time - everything weighed/measured, down to the gram. I lost quite a bit of weight, but it was extremely mentally taxing. Results were solid, but I didn't get exactly what I wanted. Second time - I just basically cut processed carbs and most fats (excluding those from my protein sources) out and ate whatever I wanted as long as it was a protein, fruit, or vegetable. Again, the results weren't bad, but they weren't as good as my first attempt.

Current height/weight: 5' 9"/158lbs. w/ an estimated BF of 20%. May be a little higher or a little lower. I don't really know since I'm relying on the Navy Calculator for that.

Target weight: 138lbs. (I think I'm going to have to get this low to actually see my abs...or have them look the way I want them to.)

Plan: Going to have to go with the weighed/measured approach to get what I want, but I'm considering leaving out approximately 100-200 calories a day during the week to give me a little more "wiggle room" on the weekends.

Workouts: I'm planning on transitioning from a blended training approach (low reps/higher weight on main lifts w/ higher reps/lower weights on accessories) to a full on higher reps/lower weights across the board. This may or may not include stopping most of my barbell work entirely (e.g. subbing in hack squats for barbell squats, etc.).

Questions for the hive mind -

1. What do you think of the overall plan? (Do you think my target weight is too low?)
2. Do you have a preferred calculator you use for daily caloric intakes as well as macro breakdowns for stuff like this?
3. Is there a better way to figure out my starting BF% that won't cost me a bunch of money?
4. Is there anything I seem to be missing here?

1. There is no way to know that without seeing you in person, being honest. You may be better served with a different approach than a straight up cut. Or maybe you are better off with a cut.
2. No. Baseline is 14-16 calories per pound of bodyweight, adjust as individually necessary. Some people need more some less, it depends on a few things.
3. It is largely irrelevant. You can order a pair of calipers and do it yourself or withyour wife's help. One of the few things Greg Doucette is good for is a few videos explaining how to use the calipers in detail while demonstrating on someone. Past curiosity, it doesn't matter. How your clothes fit and what you see in the mirror are more important than the number.
4. Don't try and do a cut while also dialling up calorie expenditure. Do one or the other, then maybe both at the same time. You are far better upping exercise volume while maintaining status quo on diet so as to measure the effect in isolation. Also, better to burn off the calories than cut them, from a metabolism perspective.
You might want to consider watching a few things from prep coaches, ElitFTS has had some excellent videos over the last year, like the Table Talk with Mike Van Wyck (Wykk?) for example. There are certainly others out there as well, that one just came to mind.

[augeleven]

On day 5 back on the cut train “for realsies”.

I seem to have 4 speeds
1) for realsies cut - losing 1-2 pounds a week
2) normal cut losing .3 -1 pound a week
3) casual cut lose .5 to gain .5 a week
4) maintenance - gain a pound + a week

I assume this means to stay in maintenance, I need to always be trying to lose a couple pounds? Also if I “accidentally” gain a couple of months, but I’m training hard and eating lots of protein - some of that has to be muscle, right?
Right?

[broseph]

4) maintenance - gain a pound + a week

I assume this means to stay in maintenance, I need to always be trying to lose a couple pounds? Also if I “accidentally” gain a couple of months, but I’m training hard and eating lots of protein - some of that has to be muscle, right?
Right?

This made me lol.

Super slow bulking is way harder than any form of cutting.

[CheekiBreekiFitness]

Planning to do an extended cut starting February 1st through the end of May. I learned quite a bit the last two times I cut, so I'm hoping I'm a bit more successful this time around. First time - everything weighed/measured, down to the gram. I lost quite a bit of weight, but it was extremely mentally taxing. Results were solid, but I didn't get exactly what I wanted. Second time - I just basically cut processed carbs and most fats (excluding those from my protein sources) out and ate whatever I wanted as long as it was a protein, fruit, or vegetable. Again, the results weren't bad, but they weren't as good as my first attempt.

Current height/weight: 5' 9"/158lbs. w/ an estimated BF of 20%. May be a little higher or a little lower. I don't really know since I'm relying on the Navy Calculator for that.

Target weight: 138lbs. (I think I'm going to have to get this low to actually see my abs...or have them look the way I want them to.)

Plan: Going to have to go with the weighed/measured approach to get what I want, but I'm considering leaving out approximately 100-200 calories a day during the week to give me a little more "wiggle room" on the weekends.

Workouts: I'm planning on transitioning from a blended training approach (low reps/higher weight on main lifts w/ higher reps/lower weights on accessories) to a full on higher reps/lower weights across the board. This may or may not include stopping most of my barbell work entirely (e.g. subbing in hack squats for barbell squats, etc.).

Questions for the hive mind -

1. What do you think of the overall plan? (Do you think my target weight is too low?)
2. Do you have a preferred calculator you use for daily caloric intakes as well as macro breakdowns for stuff like this?
3. Is there a better way to figure out my starting BF% that won't cost me a bunch of money?
4. Is there anything I seem to be missing here?

1. Cutting heavy barbell work is fine if you only care about body composition/hypertrophy, but you'll lose some strength from lack of practice. It's for you to decide what you care about. The upside of the approach is that it prevents you from overthinking when you see your strength going down during the cut. If you plan to lose 20 lbs, which is a lot for you (13% of your total weight), maybe you can plan a diet break somewhere in the middle. Otherwise you'll have to cut for 20 weeks straight, which might take a toll on you mentally. Personally if I cut more than a few weeks in a row it tends to drive me a bit insane, but you probably have more self control than I do.
2. MyFitnessPal: free, and it takes me 5 minutes a day to log all of my food for the day.
3. I think the best way is to forget about BF% since it cannot be measured accurately without dissection, and it does give you information about what you are trying to achieve (see your abs).The best way is to track waist size and scale weight and the mirror.
4. Some unwanted advice (feel free to disregard): If your BF% estimate is correct, and you are really 5'9 160 lbs and 20% BF that means you have an FFMI of 19 which indicates that you have very little muscle on your frame. You can certainly do a cut now, but after it is done I really think that you'd benefit from spending the few years after focusing on hypertrophy and in a caloric surplus.

[CheekiBreekiFitness]

4) maintenance - gain a pound + a week

I assume this means to stay in maintenance, I need to always be trying to lose a couple pounds? Also if I “accidentally” gain a couple of months, but I’m training hard and eating lots of protein - some of that has to be muscle, right?
Right?

This made me lol.

Super slow bulking is way harder than any form of cutting.

Really ? Super slow bulking is my natural, comfortable state. Cutting is something that is not comfortable in the slightest for me. I guess we all have different mechanisms that regulate food intake.

[Wilhelm]

194.2lbs this AM

Went slightly lower yesterday with 2,250 calories.
I'm starting to think 190 is doable without tanking my lifts.

That remains to be seen however.

[augeleven]

Had my first off-diet day yesterday.
In attempting to keep things process vs goal oriented, my cutting strategy is this.

31 days of dieting at 2700 calories (~900 calorie deficit)
Every day I’m at (round to the nearest 100 or so) or under counts as a day. If I go over by more than 100, then the day doesn’t count. For every 300 calories I go over, I add a day to the diet.

To me this seems reasonable, and in line with the “slack with a cost” approach SBS touts.

From a goals prospective, this gets me down to about 197, at probably 16%-20% body fat, measured by waist tape.
I’d still be no where near “fit”, but it’s a lot better than where I’ve been, and I probably need to learn actual maintenance skills.
Any red flags?

[Brackish]

4. Some unwanted advice (feel free to disregard): If your BF% estimate is correct, and you are really 5'9 160 lbs and 20% BF that means you have an FFMI of 19 which indicates that you have very little muscle on your frame. You can certainly do a cut now, but after it is done I really think that you'd benefit from spending the few years after focusing on hypertrophy and in a caloric surplus.

I'm honestly not sure about the 20%. I'm never sure if I'm measuring correctly or not (stomach sucked in/relaxed/etc.). It could be less? I've tried looking at the picture charts people post, but I always feel like I'm somewhere in between those. This was me in the middle of June this year at about 150lbs. Is that what a FFMI of 19 looks like? Am I really that scrawny? I think I estimated myself to be about 15% BF in those photos.

https://imgur.com/a/DNiZAyy

I can, with 100% certainty, tell you that I was the poster boy for skinny fat when I started lifting 3 years ago. Very little muscle to speak of, which is odd to me since I was a multi-sport athlete in high school, and continued playing lacrosse throughout college and as an adult (not organized teams, mostly pick up stuff...but still). That being said, I always relied on my speed to survive because I certainly wasn't muscling anyone around on the field.

[FredM]

4. Some unwanted advice (feel free to disregard): If your BF% estimate is correct, and you are really 5'9 160 lbs and 20% BF that means you have an FFMI of 19 which indicates that you have very little muscle on your frame. You can certainly do a cut now, but after it is done I really think that you'd benefit from spending the few years after focusing on hypertrophy and in a caloric surplus.

I'm honestly not sure about the 20%. I'm never sure if I'm measuring correctly or not (stomach sucked in/relaxed/etc.). It could be less? I've tried looking at the picture charts people post, but I always feel like I'm somewhere in between those. This was me in the middle of June this year at about 150lbs. Is that what a FFMI of 19 looks like? Am I really that scrawny? I think I estimated myself to be about 15% BF in those photos.

https://imgur.com/a/DNiZAyy

I can, with 100% certainty, tell you that I was the poster boy for skinny fat when I started lifting 3 years ago. Very little muscle to speak of, which is odd to me since I was a multi-sport athlete in high school, and continued playing lacrosse throughout college and as an adult (not organized teams, mostly pick up stuff...but still). That being said, I always relied on my speed to survive because I certainly wasn't muscling anyone around on the field.

I think 15% is a good estimate there. Also that's about what I want to get to on a cut before bulking for 4-12 months.

I think cutting until you see abs is totally overrated unless seeing abs is a primary goal of yours. SBS has done multiple write ups on how the "conventional wisdom" of being a certain BF%/ "hormone mileu" before bulking is nonsense. Personally I can't bulk at 178 lbs and 20% BF because I hate the way I look fatter than this and I won't be able to commit to a bulk like I should.

If you bulked intelligently from 150 to 160 and are in a cut phase now, I'd probably cut to 145 before bulking again. 138 seems pretty low. Unless you really need to see your abs, then 135 might be what it takes. Personally I'm fine waiting longer to see abs by cutting/bulking in the 15-20% bf range until abs come at closer to 165 lbs for me (vs. the 155-160 it'd probably take now).

It's all personal preference though. You could also bulk slowly and have similar or better long term results but, again, that's dependent on whether you can live with yourself in the mirror while you do it.

[FredM]

The flu threw a big wet blanket on my cut; I completely stopped losing weight and gained a bit on my umbilicus. I'm all better now, and I think I'm going to continue cutting into January even though my initial plan was to start maintenance on Jan. 1.

I still want to bulk through November, filling out the 90kg weight class for the meet then. I'm willing to start the bulk a little later if I can shave a few more pounds and a few quarter inches off my umbilicus if I can get the cut back on track quickly.

Same. RSV though. Hysterically worse than COVID was for most of my household and hit me and my 1 year old the hardest. Was basically 1 week into the cut and felt like I needed to eat just to survive. Sickest I've ever been in my life for 10 days and wasn't over it for 3 weeks almost. Then holiday season hit and I'm basically at square one (I'm down 2 lbs probably of just water weight).

So here goes again. Cutting hard starting tomorrow. Gonna be on that sweet New Years resolution of not being fat train.

Realistically I won't be bulking until the summer now.

RSV with the little ones is no joke. A cousin had their infant in the ER twice in one year with RSV.

***

I got the cut back on track I think; we'll see if the umbilicus will move in the right direction.

We had the neighbor's two oldest boys for a few nights right before Christmas because their littlest one (about 2 months old) ended up in the ICU due to RSV. That shit is nasty, for sure.

Yeah. I know two parents who had to live that. Terrible. Fortunately my son was only as sick as me which was absolutely miserable as a parent but no ICU visits (just one doctor's office visit). Our 4 year old and my wife just had a pre-pandemic cold though.

[Culican]

I am involved in a phase 3 trial of an RSV vaccine for older adults at this very moment. I didn't realize it but along with the toll RSV takes on kids, it also kills more older adults than influenza some years. Several companies are working on vaccines. The trial I am in is for Bavarian Nordic.

Back in October I had either a shot of pure saline or a shot of the vaccine (50% chance). Given the malaise and fever that lasted ~2 days and the sore red arm (with a nice hard lump where the shot was given), which lasted a week, I think I got the real thing.

As far a cutting, a little over a year ago I started only eating 2x/day (breakfast and dinner) ignoring the bro-science that I would waste away if I didn't have protein every 5hr or so. That has enabled me to go from 205lb to 168lb fairly effortlessly.

[FredM]

I am involved in a phase 3 trial of an RSV vaccine for older adults at this very moment. I didn't realize it but along with the toll RSV takes on kids, it also kills more older adults than influenza some years. Several companies are working on vaccines. The trial I am in is for Bavarian Nordic.

Back in October I had either a shot of pure saline or a shot of the vaccine (50% chance). Given the malaise and fever that lasted ~2 days and the sore red arm (with a nice hard lump where the shot was given), which lasted a week, I think I got the real thing.

As far a cutting, a little over a year ago I started only eating 2x/day (breakfast and dinner) ignoring the bro-science that I would waste away if I didn't have protein every 5hr or so. That has enabled me to go from 205lb to 168lb fairly effortlessly.

Very cool (on both fronts).

RSV has always been worse than people realize but isolating over COVID definitely made it supercharged this year. A vax would be nice.

Do you literally mean breakfast and dinner? I'm doing that now if you call breakfast my 5pm dinner and dinner my meal before bed at 9pm (with an extra meal on workout days).

If I try to eat breakfast and dinner more literally (I've tried) I'm absolutely dying for at least 3 hours before dinner. As soon as that fire gets stoked on a cut it's running hot. I can keep it on standby with a few cups of coffee until 3pm with almost no effort though (and 5pm with a normal amount of cut misery effort)

[broseph]

4) maintenance - gain a pound + a week

I assume this means to stay in maintenance, I need to always be trying to lose a couple pounds? Also if I “accidentally” gain a couple of months, but I’m training hard and eating lots of protein - some of that has to be muscle, right?
Right?

This made me lol.

Super slow bulking is way harder than any form of cutting.

Really ? Super slow bulking is my natural, comfortable state. Cutting is something that is not comfortable in the slightest for me. I guess we all have different mechanisms that regulate food intake.

Weird. Maintenance is my natural state- I eat mostly healthy foods all day plus dessert after dinner. If I indulge in donuts at work (or whatever), then no dessert. Don't count macros, weight stays super consistent.

Cutting is SIMPLE, but not EASY. I consistently track macros and can only eat healthy foods (because a single indulgence leaves no calories left for the day).

For bulking, it seems like I slowly titrate calories up until a threshold is met and then I gain a pound per week and it's all in my midsection.

[Culican]

I am involved in a phase 3 trial of an RSV vaccine for older adults at this very moment. I didn't realize it but along with the toll RSV takes on kids, it also kills more older adults than influenza some years. Several companies are working on vaccines. The trial I am in is for Bavarian Nordic.

Back in October I had either a shot of pure saline or a shot of the vaccine (50% chance). Given the malaise and fever that lasted ~2 days and the sore red arm (with a nice hard lump where the shot was given), which lasted a week, I think I got the real thing.

As far a cutting, a little over a year ago I started only eating 2x/day (breakfast and dinner) ignoring the bro-science that I would waste away if I didn't have protein every 5hr or so. That has enabled me to go from 205lb to 168lb fairly effortlessly.

Do you literally mean breakfast and dinner? I'm doing that now if you call breakfast my 5pm dinner and dinner my meal before bed at 9pm (with an extra meal on workout days).

If I try to eat breakfast and dinner more literally (I've tried) I'm absolutely dying for at least 3 hours before dinner. As soon as that fire gets stoked on a cut it's running hot. I can keep it on standby with a few cups of coffee until 3pm with almost no effort though (and 5pm with a normal amount of cut misery effort)

I usually have breakfast about 8:30am and dinner about 7:30pm. I know what you mean though; about 4pm I really start thinking about dinner.

I may try your way though. I have noticed that when my breakfast has been delayed until 10 or 11am it didn't really bother me. Maybe I'll try to move "breakfast" later in the day.